Title: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: AV6NHBP6SPD on February 28, 2009, 06:55:59 PM
so we dont get offtopic in what you do to your 7th gen, here is new thread
i need to get new battery, which you recomend.
i found this
Interstate MEGA-TRON PLUS - 85 MONTHS - 640 CCA (800CA) about $120
MEGA-TRON - 75 MONTHS - 550 CCA(690CA) about $113
Duralast Gold
35-DL 500CCA (625CA) red top $90
35-DLG 640CCA (800CA) yellow top $100
honda
Honda Part 31500-SL5-100M $84
http://www.hondapartsnow.com/Page_Produ ... TERY%20(V6 (http://www.hondapartsnow.com/Page_Product/Parts_Detail.aspx?catalogid=14SDN0&appid=1121&page=B%20%200601&pagename=BATTERY%20(V6))
battery cover is nice. i might get it as well
READ BEFORE YOU CHOOSE BATTERY. DEEP CYCLE VS REGULAR BATTERY
i need to get new battery, which you recomend.
i found this
Interstate MEGA-TRON PLUS - 85 MONTHS - 640 CCA (800CA) about $120
MEGA-TRON - 75 MONTHS - 550 CCA(690CA) about $113
Duralast Gold
35-DL 500CCA (625CA) red top $90
35-DLG 640CCA (800CA) yellow top $100
honda
Honda Part 31500-SL5-100M $84
http://www.hondapartsnow.com/Page_Produ ... TERY%20(V6 (http://www.hondapartsnow.com/Page_Product/Parts_Detail.aspx?catalogid=14SDN0&appid=1121&page=B%20%200601&pagename=BATTERY%20(V6))
battery cover is nice. i might get it as well
READ BEFORE YOU CHOOSE BATTERY. DEEP CYCLE VS REGULAR BATTERY
Quote from: "timot_one"
If you discharge or "deep cycle" a regular lead acid "starter" battery, it will never be able to fully recover to 100% capacity. If you deep cycle your battery too many times, it becomes a boat anchor. Deep cycle batteries are designed to be discharged down to about 20% of their capacity, and still be able to be recharged to 100% capacity with no damage. The benefits of a deep cycle battery is for people who run electronic accessories with their engine off. Usually people who do car shows or audio shows would benefit from a deep cycle battery if they do not use a battery tender while showcasing their car.
Here's an article that can explain it a lot better than I can.
What is the difference between a normal lead-acid car battery and a deep cycle battery? ([url]http://www.howstuffworks.com/question219.htm[/url])
Here's some more info that I also found.
Starting (sometimes called SLI, for starting, lighting, ignition) batteries are commonly used to start and run engines. Engine starters need a very large starting current for a very short time. Starting batteries have a large number of thin plates for maximum surface area. The plates are composed of a Lead "sponge", similar in appearance to a very fine foam sponge. This gives a very large surface area, but if deep cycled, this sponge will quickly be consumed and fall to the bottom of the cells. Automotive batteries will generally fail after 30-150 deep cycles if deep cycled, while they may last for thousands of cycles in normal starting use (2-5% discharge).
Deep cycle batteries are designed to be discharged down as much as 80% time after time, and have much thicker plates. The major difference between a true deep cycle battery and others is that the plates are SOLID Lead plates - not sponge. This gives less surface area, thus less "instant" power like starting batteries need.
Unfortunately, it is often impossible to tell what you are really buying in some of the discount stores or places that specialize in automotive batteries. The golf car battery is quite popular for small systems and RV's. The problem is that "golf car" refers to a size of battery (commonly called GC-2, or T-105), not the type or construction - so the quality and construction of a golf car battery can vary considerably - ranging from the cheap off brand with thin plates up the true deep cycle brands, such as Crown, Deka, Trojan, etc. In general, you get what you pay for.
Marine batteries are usually a "hybrid", and fall between the starting and deep-cycle batteries, though a few (Rolls-Surrette and Concorde, for example) are true deep cycle. In the hybrid, the plates may be composed of Lead sponge, but it is coarser and heavier than that used in starting batteries. It is often hard to tell what you are getting in a "marine" battery, but most are a hybrid. Starting batteries are usually rated at "CCA", or cold cranking amps, or "MCA", Marine cranking amps - the same as "CA". Any battery with the capacity shown in CA or MCA may not be a true deep-cycle battery. It is sometimes hard to tell, as the term deep cycle is often overused. CA and MCA ratings are at 32 degrees F, while CCA is at zero degree F. Unfortunately, the only positive way to tell with some batteries is to buy one and cut it open - not much of an option.
Using a deep cycle battery as a starting battery
There is generally no problem with this, providing that allowance is made for the lower cranking amps compared to a similar size starting battery. As a general rule, if you are going to use a true deep cycle battery (such as the Concorde SunXtender) also as a starting battery, it should be oversized about 20% compared to the existing or recommended starting battery group size to get the same cranking amps. That is about the same as replacing a group 24 with a group 31. With modern engines with fuel injection and electronic ignition, it generally takes much less battery power to crank and start them, so raw cranking amps is less important than it used to be. On the other hand, many cars, boats, and RV's are more heavily loaded with power sucking "appliances", such as megawatt stereo systems etc. that are more suited for deep cycle batteries. We have used the Concorde SunXtender AGM batteries in some of our vehicles with no problems.
It will not hurt a deep cycle battery to be used as a starting battery, but for the same size battery they cannot supply as much cranking amps as a regular starting battery.
Battery Construction Materials
Nearly all large rechargeable batteries in common use are Lead-Acid type. (There are some NiCads in use, but for most purposes the very high initial expense, and the high expense of disposal, does not justify them). The acid is typically 30% Sulfuric acid and 70% water at full charge. NiFe (Nickel-Iron) batteries are also available - these have a very long life, but rather poor efficiency (60-70%) and the voltages are different, making it more difficult to match up with standard 12v/24/48v systems and inverters. The biggest problem with NiFe batteries is that you may have to put in 100 watts to get 70 watts of charge - they are much less efficient than Lead-Acid. What you save on batteries you will have to make up for by buying a larger solar panel system. NiCads are also inefficient - typically around 65% - and very expensive. However, NiCads can be frozen without damage, so are sometimes used in areas where the temperatures may fall below -50 degrees F. Most AGM batteries will also survive freezing with no problems, even though the output when frozen will be little or nothing.
Industrial deep cycle batteries
Sometimes called "fork lift", "traction" or "stationary" batteries, are used where power is needed over a longer period of time, and are designed to be "deep cycled", or discharged down as low as 20% of full charge (80% DOD, or Depth of Discharge). These are often called traction batteries because of their widespread use in forklifts, golf carts, and floor sweepers (from which we get the "GC" and "FS" series of battery sizes). Deep cycle batteries have much thicker plates than automotive batteries.
Cycles vs Life
A battery "cycle" is one complete discharge and recharge cycle. It is usually considered to be discharging from 100% to 20%, and then back to 100%. However, there are often ratings for other depth of discharge cycles, the most common ones are 10%, 20%, and 50%. You have to be careful when looking at ratings that list how many cycles a battery is rated for unless it also states how far down it is being discharged. For example, one of the widely advertised telephone type (float service) batteries have been advertised as having a 20-year life. If you look at the fine print, it has that rating only at 5% DOD - it is much less when used in an application where they are cycled deeper on a regular basis. Those same batteries are rated at less than 5 years if cycled to 50%. For example, most golf cart batteries are rated for about 550 cycles to 50% discharge - which equates to about 2 years.
How depth of discharge affects cycle life on batteriesBattery life is directly related to how deep the battery is cycled each time. If a battery is discharged to 50% every day, it will last about twice as long as if it is cycled to 80% DOD. If cycled only 10% DOD, it will last about 5 times as long as one cycled to 50%. Obviously, there are some practical limitations on this - you don't usually want to have a 5 ton pile of batteries sitting there just to reduce the DOD. The most practical number to use is 50% DOD on a regular basis. This does NOT mean you cannot go to 80% once in a while. It's just that when designing a system when you have some idea of the loads, you should figure on an average DOD of around 50% for the best storage vs cost factor. Also, there is an upper limit - a battery that is continually cycled 5% or less will usually not last as long as one cycled down 10%. This happens because at very shallow cycles, the Lead Dioxide tends to build up in clumps on the the positive plates rather in an even film. The graph above shows how lifespan is affected by depth of discharge. The chart is for a Concorde Lifeline battery, but all lead-acid batteries will be similar in the shape of the curve, although the number of cycles will vary.
Here's an article that can explain it a lot better than I can.
What is the difference between a normal lead-acid car battery and a deep cycle battery? ([url]http://www.howstuffworks.com/question219.htm[/url])
Quote from: "How Stuff Works"
What is the difference between a normal lead-acid car battery and a deep cycle battery?
People who have recreational vehicles (RVs) and boats are familiar with deep cycle batteries. These batteries are also common in golf carts and large solar power systems (the sun produces power during the day and the batteries store some of the power for use at night). If you have read the article How Emergency Power Systems Work, then you also know that an alternative to gasoline-powered generators is an inverter powered by one or more deep cycle batteries.
Quiz Corner
How much you know about batteries and what they do? Test your knowledge with our Batteries Quiz!
Both car batteries and deep cycle batteries are lead-acid batteries that use exactly the same chemistry for their operation (see How Batteries Work for more information). The difference is in the way that the batteries optimize their design:
A car's battery is designed to provide a very large amount of current for a short period of time. This surge of current is needed to turn the engine over during starting. Once the engine starts, the alternator provides all the power that the car needs, so a car battery may go through its entire life without ever being drained more than 20 percent of its total capacity. Used in this way, a car battery can last a number of years. To achieve a large amount of current, a car battery uses thin plates in order to increase its surface area.
A deep cycle battery is designed to provide a steady amount of current over a long period of time. A deep cycle battery can provide a surge when needed, but nothing like the surge a car battery can. A deep cycle battery is also designed to be deeply discharged over and over again (something that would ruin a car battery very quickly). To accomplish this, a deep cycle battery uses thicker plates.
A car battery typically has two ratings:
* CCA (Cold Cranking Amps) - The number of amps that the battery can produce at 32 degrees F (0 degrees C) for 30 seconds
* RC (Reserve Capacity) - The number of minutes that the battery can deliver 25 amps while keeping its voltage above 10.5 volts
Typically, a deep cycle battery will have two or three times the RC of a car battery, but will deliver one-half or three-quarters the CCAs. In addition, a deep cycle battery can withstand several hundred total discharge/recharge cycles, while a car battery is not designed to be totally discharged.
People who have recreational vehicles (RVs) and boats are familiar with deep cycle batteries. These batteries are also common in golf carts and large solar power systems (the sun produces power during the day and the batteries store some of the power for use at night). If you have read the article How Emergency Power Systems Work, then you also know that an alternative to gasoline-powered generators is an inverter powered by one or more deep cycle batteries.
Quiz Corner
How much you know about batteries and what they do? Test your knowledge with our Batteries Quiz!
Both car batteries and deep cycle batteries are lead-acid batteries that use exactly the same chemistry for their operation (see How Batteries Work for more information). The difference is in the way that the batteries optimize their design:
A car's battery is designed to provide a very large amount of current for a short period of time. This surge of current is needed to turn the engine over during starting. Once the engine starts, the alternator provides all the power that the car needs, so a car battery may go through its entire life without ever being drained more than 20 percent of its total capacity. Used in this way, a car battery can last a number of years. To achieve a large amount of current, a car battery uses thin plates in order to increase its surface area.
A deep cycle battery is designed to provide a steady amount of current over a long period of time. A deep cycle battery can provide a surge when needed, but nothing like the surge a car battery can. A deep cycle battery is also designed to be deeply discharged over and over again (something that would ruin a car battery very quickly). To accomplish this, a deep cycle battery uses thicker plates.
A car battery typically has two ratings:
* CCA (Cold Cranking Amps) - The number of amps that the battery can produce at 32 degrees F (0 degrees C) for 30 seconds
* RC (Reserve Capacity) - The number of minutes that the battery can deliver 25 amps while keeping its voltage above 10.5 volts
Typically, a deep cycle battery will have two or three times the RC of a car battery, but will deliver one-half or three-quarters the CCAs. In addition, a deep cycle battery can withstand several hundred total discharge/recharge cycles, while a car battery is not designed to be totally discharged.
Here's some more info that I also found.
Starting (sometimes called SLI, for starting, lighting, ignition) batteries are commonly used to start and run engines. Engine starters need a very large starting current for a very short time. Starting batteries have a large number of thin plates for maximum surface area. The plates are composed of a Lead "sponge", similar in appearance to a very fine foam sponge. This gives a very large surface area, but if deep cycled, this sponge will quickly be consumed and fall to the bottom of the cells. Automotive batteries will generally fail after 30-150 deep cycles if deep cycled, while they may last for thousands of cycles in normal starting use (2-5% discharge).
Deep cycle batteries are designed to be discharged down as much as 80% time after time, and have much thicker plates. The major difference between a true deep cycle battery and others is that the plates are SOLID Lead plates - not sponge. This gives less surface area, thus less "instant" power like starting batteries need.
Unfortunately, it is often impossible to tell what you are really buying in some of the discount stores or places that specialize in automotive batteries. The golf car battery is quite popular for small systems and RV's. The problem is that "golf car" refers to a size of battery (commonly called GC-2, or T-105), not the type or construction - so the quality and construction of a golf car battery can vary considerably - ranging from the cheap off brand with thin plates up the true deep cycle brands, such as Crown, Deka, Trojan, etc. In general, you get what you pay for.
Marine batteries are usually a "hybrid", and fall between the starting and deep-cycle batteries, though a few (Rolls-Surrette and Concorde, for example) are true deep cycle. In the hybrid, the plates may be composed of Lead sponge, but it is coarser and heavier than that used in starting batteries. It is often hard to tell what you are getting in a "marine" battery, but most are a hybrid. Starting batteries are usually rated at "CCA", or cold cranking amps, or "MCA", Marine cranking amps - the same as "CA". Any battery with the capacity shown in CA or MCA may not be a true deep-cycle battery. It is sometimes hard to tell, as the term deep cycle is often overused. CA and MCA ratings are at 32 degrees F, while CCA is at zero degree F. Unfortunately, the only positive way to tell with some batteries is to buy one and cut it open - not much of an option.
Using a deep cycle battery as a starting battery
There is generally no problem with this, providing that allowance is made for the lower cranking amps compared to a similar size starting battery. As a general rule, if you are going to use a true deep cycle battery (such as the Concorde SunXtender) also as a starting battery, it should be oversized about 20% compared to the existing or recommended starting battery group size to get the same cranking amps. That is about the same as replacing a group 24 with a group 31. With modern engines with fuel injection and electronic ignition, it generally takes much less battery power to crank and start them, so raw cranking amps is less important than it used to be. On the other hand, many cars, boats, and RV's are more heavily loaded with power sucking "appliances", such as megawatt stereo systems etc. that are more suited for deep cycle batteries. We have used the Concorde SunXtender AGM batteries in some of our vehicles with no problems.
It will not hurt a deep cycle battery to be used as a starting battery, but for the same size battery they cannot supply as much cranking amps as a regular starting battery.
Battery Construction Materials
Nearly all large rechargeable batteries in common use are Lead-Acid type. (There are some NiCads in use, but for most purposes the very high initial expense, and the high expense of disposal, does not justify them). The acid is typically 30% Sulfuric acid and 70% water at full charge. NiFe (Nickel-Iron) batteries are also available - these have a very long life, but rather poor efficiency (60-70%) and the voltages are different, making it more difficult to match up with standard 12v/24/48v systems and inverters. The biggest problem with NiFe batteries is that you may have to put in 100 watts to get 70 watts of charge - they are much less efficient than Lead-Acid. What you save on batteries you will have to make up for by buying a larger solar panel system. NiCads are also inefficient - typically around 65% - and very expensive. However, NiCads can be frozen without damage, so are sometimes used in areas where the temperatures may fall below -50 degrees F. Most AGM batteries will also survive freezing with no problems, even though the output when frozen will be little or nothing.
Industrial deep cycle batteries
Sometimes called "fork lift", "traction" or "stationary" batteries, are used where power is needed over a longer period of time, and are designed to be "deep cycled", or discharged down as low as 20% of full charge (80% DOD, or Depth of Discharge). These are often called traction batteries because of their widespread use in forklifts, golf carts, and floor sweepers (from which we get the "GC" and "FS" series of battery sizes). Deep cycle batteries have much thicker plates than automotive batteries.
Cycles vs Life
A battery "cycle" is one complete discharge and recharge cycle. It is usually considered to be discharging from 100% to 20%, and then back to 100%. However, there are often ratings for other depth of discharge cycles, the most common ones are 10%, 20%, and 50%. You have to be careful when looking at ratings that list how many cycles a battery is rated for unless it also states how far down it is being discharged. For example, one of the widely advertised telephone type (float service) batteries have been advertised as having a 20-year life. If you look at the fine print, it has that rating only at 5% DOD - it is much less when used in an application where they are cycled deeper on a regular basis. Those same batteries are rated at less than 5 years if cycled to 50%. For example, most golf cart batteries are rated for about 550 cycles to 50% discharge - which equates to about 2 years.
How depth of discharge affects cycle life on batteriesBattery life is directly related to how deep the battery is cycled each time. If a battery is discharged to 50% every day, it will last about twice as long as if it is cycled to 80% DOD. If cycled only 10% DOD, it will last about 5 times as long as one cycled to 50%. Obviously, there are some practical limitations on this - you don't usually want to have a 5 ton pile of batteries sitting there just to reduce the DOD. The most practical number to use is 50% DOD on a regular basis. This does NOT mean you cannot go to 80% once in a while. It's just that when designing a system when you have some idea of the loads, you should figure on an average DOD of around 50% for the best storage vs cost factor. Also, there is an upper limit - a battery that is continually cycled 5% or less will usually not last as long as one cycled down 10%. This happens because at very shallow cycles, the Lead Dioxide tends to build up in clumps on the the positive plates rather in an even film. The graph above shows how lifespan is affected by depth of discharge. The chart is for a Concorde Lifeline battery, but all lead-acid batteries will be similar in the shape of the curve, although the number of cycles will vary.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: k24low20z on February 28, 2009, 07:33:13 PM
Quote from: "AV6NHBP6SPD"
so we dont get offtopic in what you do to your 7th gen, here is new thread
i need to get new battery, which you recomend.
i found this
Interstate MEGA-TRON PLUS - 85 MONTHS - 640 CCA (800CA) about $120
MEGA-TRON - 75 MONTHS - 550 CCA(690CA) about $113
Duralast Gold
35-DL 500CCA (625CA) red top $90
35-DLG 640CCA (800CA) yellow top $100
honda
Honda Part 31500-SL5-100M $84
[url]http://www.hondapartsnow.com/Page_Produ[/url] ... TERY%20(V6 ([url]http://www.hondapartsnow.com/Page_Product/Parts_Detail.aspx?catalogid=14SDN0&appid=1121&page=B%20%200601&pagename=BATTERY%20(V6))[/url]
battery cover is nice. i might get it as well
i need to get new battery, which you recomend.
i found this
Interstate MEGA-TRON PLUS - 85 MONTHS - 640 CCA (800CA) about $120
MEGA-TRON - 75 MONTHS - 550 CCA(690CA) about $113
Duralast Gold
35-DL 500CCA (625CA) red top $90
35-DLG 640CCA (800CA) yellow top $100
honda
Honda Part 31500-SL5-100M $84
[url]http://www.hondapartsnow.com/Page_Produ[/url] ... TERY%20(V6 ([url]http://www.hondapartsnow.com/Page_Product/Parts_Detail.aspx?catalogid=14SDN0&appid=1121&page=B%20%200601&pagename=BATTERY%20(V6))[/url]
battery cover is nice. i might get it as well
red, yellow, blue top optima batteries ftmfw!
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: Abailey4 on February 28, 2009, 07:36:16 PM
^Due to the recent news Thien gave us an Oddysey may be a better choice.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: MyNameIsThien on February 28, 2009, 07:41:42 PM
You might want to reconsider Optima. Optima is going out of business. Their new design in batteries are inferior. They no longer have cells in every tube, but instead in every other tube. They had a mass recall 2-3 months ago. The plant use to be located here in Colorado, only a few miles from my place. They shutdown that plant and moved to Mexico. Two to three months of the plant being opened in Mexico, it has now shutdown.
Interstate use to own Optima, but they have no dropped the company due to bad engineering and new management. Expect to no longer see Optima batteries on the shelves. I recommened either Interstate or Exide. Interstate offers a good warranty, but they do no have many deep cell options out. Exide on the other hand do offer deep cell, but they do come at a heavy price. Another battery to look into is the Odyssey batteries. They are a lightweight deep cell battery, but again, they do come at a hefty price.
I hope this helps you out on your decision on a battery.
Interstate use to own Optima, but they have no dropped the company due to bad engineering and new management. Expect to no longer see Optima batteries on the shelves. I recommened either Interstate or Exide. Interstate offers a good warranty, but they do no have many deep cell options out. Exide on the other hand do offer deep cell, but they do come at a heavy price. Another battery to look into is the Odyssey batteries. They are a lightweight deep cell battery, but again, they do come at a hefty price.
I hope this helps you out on your decision on a battery.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: cna on February 28, 2009, 09:38:52 PM
I have used the Duralast Gold 35-DLG 640CCA (800CA) yellow top $100 they worked decent never any problems
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: timot_one on March 01, 2009, 03:15:28 PM
My next battery is either going to be an Exide Select Orbital XCD Deep Cycle battery or Odyssey PC1500DT for DD use and an Odyssey ER15 lightweight battery for the track.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: Abailey4 on March 01, 2009, 03:30:19 PM
Quote from: "MyNameIsThien"
You might want to reconsider Optima. Optima is going out of business. Their new design in batteries are inferior. They no longer have cells in every tube, but instead in every other tube. They had a mass recall 2-3 months ago. The plant use to be located here in Colorado, only a few miles from my place. They shutdown that plant and moved to Mexico. Two to three months of the plant being opened in Mexico, it has now shutdown.
Interstate use to own Optima, but they have no dropped the company due to bad engineering and new management. Expect to no longer see Optima batteries on the shelves. I recommened either Interstate or Exide. Interstate offers a good warranty, but they do no have many deep cell options out. Exide on the other hand do offer deep cell, but they do come at a heavy price. Another battery to look into is the Odyssey batteries. They are a lightweight deep cell battery, but again, they do come at a hefty price.
I hope this helps you out on your decision on a battery.
Interstate use to own Optima, but they have no dropped the company due to bad engineering and new management. Expect to no longer see Optima batteries on the shelves. I recommened either Interstate or Exide. Interstate offers a good warranty, but they do no have many deep cell options out. Exide on the other hand do offer deep cell, but they do come at a heavy price. Another battery to look into is the Odyssey batteries. They are a lightweight deep cell battery, but again, they do come at a hefty price.
I hope this helps you out on your decision on a battery.
So basically if the little issue I'm having happens to be the battery I need to move quick so I can take advantage of the warranty.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: AV6NHBP6SPD on March 01, 2009, 07:31:11 PM
Tim. can you shed some light of benefits of deep cycle?
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: timot_one on March 01, 2009, 08:59:25 PM
If you discharge or "deep cycle" a regular lead acid "starter" battery, it will never be able to fully recover to 100% capacity. If you deep cycle your battery too many times, it becomes a boat anchor. Deep cycle batteries are designed to be discharged down to about 20% of their capacity, and still be able to be recharged to 100% capacity with no damage. The benefits of a deep cycle battery is for people who run electronic accessories with their engine off. Usually people who do car shows or audio shows would benefit from a deep cycle battery if they do not use a battery tender while showcasing their car.
Here's an article that can explain it a lot better than I can.
What is the difference between a normal lead-acid car battery and a deep cycle battery? (http://www.howstuffworks.com/question219.htm)
Here's some more info that I also found.
Starting (sometimes called SLI, for starting, lighting, ignition) batteries are commonly used to start and run engines. Engine starters need a very large starting current for a very short time. Starting batteries have a large number of thin plates for maximum surface area. The plates are composed of a Lead "sponge", similar in appearance to a very fine foam sponge. This gives a very large surface area, but if deep cycled, this sponge will quickly be consumed and fall to the bottom of the cells. Automotive batteries will generally fail after 30-150 deep cycles if deep cycled, while they may last for thousands of cycles in normal starting use (2-5% discharge).
Deep cycle batteries are designed to be discharged down as much as 80% time after time, and have much thicker plates. The major difference between a true deep cycle battery and others is that the plates are SOLID Lead plates - not sponge. This gives less surface area, thus less "instant" power like starting batteries need.
Unfortunately, it is often impossible to tell what you are really buying in some of the discount stores or places that specialize in automotive batteries. The golf car battery is quite popular for small systems and RV's. The problem is that "golf car" refers to a size of battery (commonly called GC-2, or T-105), not the type or construction - so the quality and construction of a golf car battery can vary considerably - ranging from the cheap off brand with thin plates up the true deep cycle brands, such as Crown, Deka, Trojan, etc. In general, you get what you pay for.
Marine batteries are usually a "hybrid", and fall between the starting and deep-cycle batteries, though a few (Rolls-Surrette and Concorde, for example) are true deep cycle. In the hybrid, the plates may be composed of Lead sponge, but it is coarser and heavier than that used in starting batteries. It is often hard to tell what you are getting in a "marine" battery, but most are a hybrid. Starting batteries are usually rated at "CCA", or cold cranking amps, or "MCA", Marine cranking amps - the same as "CA". Any battery with the capacity shown in CA or MCA may not be a true deep-cycle battery. It is sometimes hard to tell, as the term deep cycle is often overused. CA and MCA ratings are at 32 degrees F, while CCA is at zero degree F. Unfortunately, the only positive way to tell with some batteries is to buy one and cut it open - not much of an option.
Using a deep cycle battery as a starting battery
There is generally no problem with this, providing that allowance is made for the lower cranking amps compared to a similar size starting battery. As a general rule, if you are going to use a true deep cycle battery (such as the Concorde SunXtender) also as a starting battery, it should be oversized about 20% compared to the existing or recommended starting battery group size to get the same cranking amps. That is about the same as replacing a group 24 with a group 31. With modern engines with fuel injection and electronic ignition, it generally takes much less battery power to crank and start them, so raw cranking amps is less important than it used to be. On the other hand, many cars, boats, and RV's are more heavily loaded with power sucking "appliances", such as megawatt stereo systems etc. that are more suited for deep cycle batteries. We have used the Concorde SunXtender AGM batteries in some of our vehicles with no problems.
It will not hurt a deep cycle battery to be used as a starting battery, but for the same size battery they cannot supply as much cranking amps as a regular starting battery.
Battery Construction Materials
Nearly all large rechargeable batteries in common use are Lead-Acid type. (There are some NiCads in use, but for most purposes the very high initial expense, and the high expense of disposal, does not justify them). The acid is typically 30% Sulfuric acid and 70% water at full charge. NiFe (Nickel-Iron) batteries are also available - these have a very long life, but rather poor efficiency (60-70%) and the voltages are different, making it more difficult to match up with standard 12v/24/48v systems and inverters. The biggest problem with NiFe batteries is that you may have to put in 100 watts to get 70 watts of charge - they are much less efficient than Lead-Acid. What you save on batteries you will have to make up for by buying a larger solar panel system. NiCads are also inefficient - typically around 65% - and very expensive. However, NiCads can be frozen without damage, so are sometimes used in areas where the temperatures may fall below -50 degrees F. Most AGM batteries will also survive freezing with no problems, even though the output when frozen will be little or nothing.
Industrial deep cycle batteries
Sometimes called "fork lift", "traction" or "stationary" batteries, are used where power is needed over a longer period of time, and are designed to be "deep cycled", or discharged down as low as 20% of full charge (80% DOD, or Depth of Discharge). These are often called traction batteries because of their widespread use in forklifts, golf carts, and floor sweepers (from which we get the "GC" and "FS" series of battery sizes). Deep cycle batteries have much thicker plates than automotive batteries.
Cycles vs Life
A battery "cycle" is one complete discharge and recharge cycle. It is usually considered to be discharging from 100% to 20%, and then back to 100%. However, there are often ratings for other depth of discharge cycles, the most common ones are 10%, 20%, and 50%. You have to be careful when looking at ratings that list how many cycles a battery is rated for unless it also states how far down it is being discharged. For example, one of the widely advertised telephone type (float service) batteries have been advertised as having a 20-year life. If you look at the fine print, it has that rating only at 5% DOD - it is much less when used in an application where they are cycled deeper on a regular basis. Those same batteries are rated at less than 5 years if cycled to 50%. For example, most golf cart batteries are rated for about 550 cycles to 50% discharge - which equates to about 2 years.
How depth of discharge affects cycle life on batteriesBattery life is directly related to how deep the battery is cycled each time. If a battery is discharged to 50% every day, it will last about twice as long as if it is cycled to 80% DOD. If cycled only 10% DOD, it will last about 5 times as long as one cycled to 50%. Obviously, there are some practical limitations on this - you don't usually want to have a 5 ton pile of batteries sitting there just to reduce the DOD. The most practical number to use is 50% DOD on a regular basis. This does NOT mean you cannot go to 80% once in a while. It's just that when designing a system when you have some idea of the loads, you should figure on an average DOD of around 50% for the best storage vs cost factor. Also, there is an upper limit - a battery that is continually cycled 5% or less will usually not last as long as one cycled down 10%. This happens because at very shallow cycles, the Lead Dioxide tends to build up in clumps on the the positive plates rather in an even film. The graph above shows how lifespan is affected by depth of discharge. The chart is for a Concorde Lifeline battery, but all lead-acid batteries will be similar in the shape of the curve, although the number of cycles will vary.
Here's an article that can explain it a lot better than I can.
What is the difference between a normal lead-acid car battery and a deep cycle battery? (http://www.howstuffworks.com/question219.htm)
Quote from: "How Stuff Works"
What is the difference between a normal lead-acid car battery and a deep cycle battery?
People who have recreational vehicles (RVs) and boats are familiar with deep cycle batteries. These batteries are also common in golf carts and large solar power systems (the sun produces power during the day and the batteries store some of the power for use at night). If you have read the article How Emergency Power Systems Work, then you also know that an alternative to gasoline-powered generators is an inverter powered by one or more deep cycle batteries.
Quiz Corner
How much you know about batteries and what they do? Test your knowledge with our Batteries Quiz!
Both car batteries and deep cycle batteries are lead-acid batteries that use exactly the same chemistry for their operation (see How Batteries Work for more information). The difference is in the way that the batteries optimize their design:
A car's battery is designed to provide a very large amount of current for a short period of time. This surge of current is needed to turn the engine over during starting. Once the engine starts, the alternator provides all the power that the car needs, so a car battery may go through its entire life without ever being drained more than 20 percent of its total capacity. Used in this way, a car battery can last a number of years. To achieve a large amount of current, a car battery uses thin plates in order to increase its surface area.
A deep cycle battery is designed to provide a steady amount of current over a long period of time. A deep cycle battery can provide a surge when needed, but nothing like the surge a car battery can. A deep cycle battery is also designed to be deeply discharged over and over again (something that would ruin a car battery very quickly). To accomplish this, a deep cycle battery uses thicker plates.
A car battery typically has two ratings:
* CCA (Cold Cranking Amps) - The number of amps that the battery can produce at 32 degrees F (0 degrees C) for 30 seconds
* RC (Reserve Capacity) - The number of minutes that the battery can deliver 25 amps while keeping its voltage above 10.5 volts
Typically, a deep cycle battery will have two or three times the RC of a car battery, but will deliver one-half or three-quarters the CCAs. In addition, a deep cycle battery can withstand several hundred total discharge/recharge cycles, while a car battery is not designed to be totally discharged.
People who have recreational vehicles (RVs) and boats are familiar with deep cycle batteries. These batteries are also common in golf carts and large solar power systems (the sun produces power during the day and the batteries store some of the power for use at night). If you have read the article How Emergency Power Systems Work, then you also know that an alternative to gasoline-powered generators is an inverter powered by one or more deep cycle batteries.
Quiz Corner
How much you know about batteries and what they do? Test your knowledge with our Batteries Quiz!
Both car batteries and deep cycle batteries are lead-acid batteries that use exactly the same chemistry for their operation (see How Batteries Work for more information). The difference is in the way that the batteries optimize their design:
A car's battery is designed to provide a very large amount of current for a short period of time. This surge of current is needed to turn the engine over during starting. Once the engine starts, the alternator provides all the power that the car needs, so a car battery may go through its entire life without ever being drained more than 20 percent of its total capacity. Used in this way, a car battery can last a number of years. To achieve a large amount of current, a car battery uses thin plates in order to increase its surface area.
A deep cycle battery is designed to provide a steady amount of current over a long period of time. A deep cycle battery can provide a surge when needed, but nothing like the surge a car battery can. A deep cycle battery is also designed to be deeply discharged over and over again (something that would ruin a car battery very quickly). To accomplish this, a deep cycle battery uses thicker plates.
A car battery typically has two ratings:
* CCA (Cold Cranking Amps) - The number of amps that the battery can produce at 32 degrees F (0 degrees C) for 30 seconds
* RC (Reserve Capacity) - The number of minutes that the battery can deliver 25 amps while keeping its voltage above 10.5 volts
Typically, a deep cycle battery will have two or three times the RC of a car battery, but will deliver one-half or three-quarters the CCAs. In addition, a deep cycle battery can withstand several hundred total discharge/recharge cycles, while a car battery is not designed to be totally discharged.
Here's some more info that I also found.
Starting (sometimes called SLI, for starting, lighting, ignition) batteries are commonly used to start and run engines. Engine starters need a very large starting current for a very short time. Starting batteries have a large number of thin plates for maximum surface area. The plates are composed of a Lead "sponge", similar in appearance to a very fine foam sponge. This gives a very large surface area, but if deep cycled, this sponge will quickly be consumed and fall to the bottom of the cells. Automotive batteries will generally fail after 30-150 deep cycles if deep cycled, while they may last for thousands of cycles in normal starting use (2-5% discharge).
Deep cycle batteries are designed to be discharged down as much as 80% time after time, and have much thicker plates. The major difference between a true deep cycle battery and others is that the plates are SOLID Lead plates - not sponge. This gives less surface area, thus less "instant" power like starting batteries need.
Unfortunately, it is often impossible to tell what you are really buying in some of the discount stores or places that specialize in automotive batteries. The golf car battery is quite popular for small systems and RV's. The problem is that "golf car" refers to a size of battery (commonly called GC-2, or T-105), not the type or construction - so the quality and construction of a golf car battery can vary considerably - ranging from the cheap off brand with thin plates up the true deep cycle brands, such as Crown, Deka, Trojan, etc. In general, you get what you pay for.
Marine batteries are usually a "hybrid", and fall between the starting and deep-cycle batteries, though a few (Rolls-Surrette and Concorde, for example) are true deep cycle. In the hybrid, the plates may be composed of Lead sponge, but it is coarser and heavier than that used in starting batteries. It is often hard to tell what you are getting in a "marine" battery, but most are a hybrid. Starting batteries are usually rated at "CCA", or cold cranking amps, or "MCA", Marine cranking amps - the same as "CA". Any battery with the capacity shown in CA or MCA may not be a true deep-cycle battery. It is sometimes hard to tell, as the term deep cycle is often overused. CA and MCA ratings are at 32 degrees F, while CCA is at zero degree F. Unfortunately, the only positive way to tell with some batteries is to buy one and cut it open - not much of an option.
Using a deep cycle battery as a starting battery
There is generally no problem with this, providing that allowance is made for the lower cranking amps compared to a similar size starting battery. As a general rule, if you are going to use a true deep cycle battery (such as the Concorde SunXtender) also as a starting battery, it should be oversized about 20% compared to the existing or recommended starting battery group size to get the same cranking amps. That is about the same as replacing a group 24 with a group 31. With modern engines with fuel injection and electronic ignition, it generally takes much less battery power to crank and start them, so raw cranking amps is less important than it used to be. On the other hand, many cars, boats, and RV's are more heavily loaded with power sucking "appliances", such as megawatt stereo systems etc. that are more suited for deep cycle batteries. We have used the Concorde SunXtender AGM batteries in some of our vehicles with no problems.
It will not hurt a deep cycle battery to be used as a starting battery, but for the same size battery they cannot supply as much cranking amps as a regular starting battery.
Battery Construction Materials
Nearly all large rechargeable batteries in common use are Lead-Acid type. (There are some NiCads in use, but for most purposes the very high initial expense, and the high expense of disposal, does not justify them). The acid is typically 30% Sulfuric acid and 70% water at full charge. NiFe (Nickel-Iron) batteries are also available - these have a very long life, but rather poor efficiency (60-70%) and the voltages are different, making it more difficult to match up with standard 12v/24/48v systems and inverters. The biggest problem with NiFe batteries is that you may have to put in 100 watts to get 70 watts of charge - they are much less efficient than Lead-Acid. What you save on batteries you will have to make up for by buying a larger solar panel system. NiCads are also inefficient - typically around 65% - and very expensive. However, NiCads can be frozen without damage, so are sometimes used in areas where the temperatures may fall below -50 degrees F. Most AGM batteries will also survive freezing with no problems, even though the output when frozen will be little or nothing.
Industrial deep cycle batteries
Sometimes called "fork lift", "traction" or "stationary" batteries, are used where power is needed over a longer period of time, and are designed to be "deep cycled", or discharged down as low as 20% of full charge (80% DOD, or Depth of Discharge). These are often called traction batteries because of their widespread use in forklifts, golf carts, and floor sweepers (from which we get the "GC" and "FS" series of battery sizes). Deep cycle batteries have much thicker plates than automotive batteries.
Cycles vs Life
A battery "cycle" is one complete discharge and recharge cycle. It is usually considered to be discharging from 100% to 20%, and then back to 100%. However, there are often ratings for other depth of discharge cycles, the most common ones are 10%, 20%, and 50%. You have to be careful when looking at ratings that list how many cycles a battery is rated for unless it also states how far down it is being discharged. For example, one of the widely advertised telephone type (float service) batteries have been advertised as having a 20-year life. If you look at the fine print, it has that rating only at 5% DOD - it is much less when used in an application where they are cycled deeper on a regular basis. Those same batteries are rated at less than 5 years if cycled to 50%. For example, most golf cart batteries are rated for about 550 cycles to 50% discharge - which equates to about 2 years.
How depth of discharge affects cycle life on batteriesBattery life is directly related to how deep the battery is cycled each time. If a battery is discharged to 50% every day, it will last about twice as long as if it is cycled to 80% DOD. If cycled only 10% DOD, it will last about 5 times as long as one cycled to 50%. Obviously, there are some practical limitations on this - you don't usually want to have a 5 ton pile of batteries sitting there just to reduce the DOD. The most practical number to use is 50% DOD on a regular basis. This does NOT mean you cannot go to 80% once in a while. It's just that when designing a system when you have some idea of the loads, you should figure on an average DOD of around 50% for the best storage vs cost factor. Also, there is an upper limit - a battery that is continually cycled 5% or less will usually not last as long as one cycled down 10%. This happens because at very shallow cycles, the Lead Dioxide tends to build up in clumps on the the positive plates rather in an even film. The graph above shows how lifespan is affected by depth of discharge. The chart is for a Concorde Lifeline battery, but all lead-acid batteries will be similar in the shape of the curve, although the number of cycles will vary.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: MyNameIsThien on March 01, 2009, 09:10:26 PM
Quote from: "Abailey4"
Quote from: "MyNameIsThien"
You might want to reconsider Optima. Optima is going out of business. Their new design in batteries are inferior. They no longer have cells in every tube, but instead in every other tube. They had a mass recall 2-3 months ago. The plant use to be located here in Colorado, only a few miles from my place. They shutdown that plant and moved to Mexico. Two to three months of the plant being opened in Mexico, it has now shutdown.
Interstate use to own Optima, but they have no dropped the company due to bad engineering and new management. Expect to no longer see Optima batteries on the shelves. I recommened either Interstate or Exide. Interstate offers a good warranty, but they do no have many deep cell options out. Exide on the other hand do offer deep cell, but they do come at a heavy price. Another battery to look into is the Odyssey batteries. They are a lightweight deep cell battery, but again, they do come at a hefty price.
I hope this helps you out on your decision on a battery.
Interstate use to own Optima, but they have no dropped the company due to bad engineering and new management. Expect to no longer see Optima batteries on the shelves. I recommened either Interstate or Exide. Interstate offers a good warranty, but they do no have many deep cell options out. Exide on the other hand do offer deep cell, but they do come at a heavy price. Another battery to look into is the Odyssey batteries. They are a lightweight deep cell battery, but again, they do come at a hefty price.
I hope this helps you out on your decision on a battery.
So basically if the little issue I'm having happens to be the battery I need to move quick so I can take advantage of the warranty.
Yes, if not you won't be able to take advantage anymore.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: suleman_manji on March 01, 2009, 09:39:58 PM
i got a superstart (i know nothing about which batteries better lol; nothing crazy electrically in my car neither)
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: MyNameIsThien on March 01, 2009, 10:31:10 PM
I have an Interstate. Works good for me, and I got it only for $60 because I work for Firestone. Firestone is an authorized Interstate retailer.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: CrazyCreashunz on March 03, 2009, 09:27:11 AM
Quote from: "MyNameIsThien"
I have an Interstate. Works good for me, and I got it only for $60 because I work for Firestone. Firestone is an authorized Interstate retailer.
So Thien since you have an Interstate, how is it for you? I wa thinking about getting the Mega Tron ll. I can get it for $80 by my house. Whatcha' think?
My battery is shot, can't hold a charge after being in the cold.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: MyNameIsThien on March 03, 2009, 12:57:30 PM
Its a good starter battery. I got it like back in October, and my car started right up when it was 20 below.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: AV6NHBP6SPD on March 03, 2009, 01:35:44 PM
anybody heard anything about Deka batteries? my friend can get them at discount and says he has it and works fine in his car
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: CrazyCreashunz on March 03, 2009, 02:08:26 PM
Quote from: "MyNameIsThien"
Its a good starter battery. I got it like back in October, and my car started right up when it was 20 below.
Kool ima pick it up on Thursday... Thanks Thien
UPDATE: Picked up the Interstate Mega Tron ll today and so far its great! and I love the green top
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: LiquidX on March 17, 2009, 04:47:22 PM
My dumbass killed my oem battery doing my mirrors, but my car did stand for about a 1 month before i came home. I just bought an Autocraft silver from AdvanceAuto for $56 after the $10 core return and my friends 25% discount. Since im only running my hids off the battery i dont need any of those expensive batteries.
On another note, when i worked at Advance back in philly, i had handful of people have major problems with the optimas, On our charging machines it took the optimas aver an hour to charge. So i never liked them to begin with.
How much stuff are you running off the battery?
On another note, when i worked at Advance back in philly, i had handful of people have major problems with the optimas, On our charging machines it took the optimas aver an hour to charge. So i never liked them to begin with.
How much stuff are you running off the battery?
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: timot_one on March 17, 2009, 11:26:22 PM
I'll repeat this again. Your battery does not power any of your electrical components while your engine is running. Your alternator powers all electrical components when your engine is running. Your battery is strictly used to start your engine and run components when your engine is not running.
I would recommend using a battery tender when you do any electrical work on your car.
I would recommend using a battery tender when you do any electrical work on your car.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: LiquidX on March 18, 2009, 12:43:29 AM
^
^ That's what i meant, like running subs or entertainment stuff. I was just being a dumbass in my situation, i completely disregarded the fact that i had those step lights and shit on. I guess we learn from our mistakes?
^ That's what i meant, like running subs or entertainment stuff. I was just being a dumbass in my situation, i completely disregarded the fact that i had those step lights and shit on. I guess we learn from our mistakes?
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: timot_one on March 18, 2009, 10:39:17 AM
Quite true. I try to always use a battery tender when doing electrical work. It's a safe step to take so you don't deep cycle the battery and reduce it's life.
Title: Broken Negative Battery Terminal
Post by: Antoni0_23 on July 04, 2009, 08:58:41 AM
Hi Guys. Me Again. This time something strange happened to me last night. I was cruising around and then I hit a streetbump and all of a sudden my car shuts off completely and the interior lights started to flicker. I open up the hood to see that the negative battery terminal snapped off of the cable. Then I made a "connection" using black electrical tape and when I turned on my car the RPM Needle was way above 8k and it remained there even when the car was on idle. When I accelerate it also stays there. I returned home and removed the battery. I was wondering what should I do? Is the RPM Needle something the ECU controls and when I put my battery back on it will go back to where it's supposed to? Also should I buy replacement terminals or the whole negative cable with the terminal? If so which terminals do you guys recommend. Is it a hard install? Thanks for your time.
Title: Re: Broken Negative Battery Terminal
Post by: NWINNIE34 on July 04, 2009, 10:04:30 AM
i would think terminals are terminals.... get a decent name brand like Monster or Street Wire tho and dont go with some ebay special.
This also gives you a chance to upgrade your ground wire... or possible think about doing a 5-7 wire home made grounding kit
http://www.google.com/products/catalog? ... sa=title#p (http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=battery+terminal&hl=en&cid=6540816070442146360&sa=title#p)
GL man... i say just rip it off...get new terminals.. (pep boys/autozone since you are in sort of a time crunch to get yur car working)
replace your ground wire with some better and maybe larger gauge wire (2-6 gauge)....call it a day
i think after that you should be able let the car idle and the ecu will reset itself
This also gives you a chance to upgrade your ground wire... or possible think about doing a 5-7 wire home made grounding kit
http://www.google.com/products/catalog? ... sa=title#p (http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=battery+terminal&hl=en&cid=6540816070442146360&sa=title#p)
GL man... i say just rip it off...get new terminals.. (pep boys/autozone since you are in sort of a time crunch to get yur car working)
replace your ground wire with some better and maybe larger gauge wire (2-6 gauge)....call it a day
i think after that you should be able let the car idle and the ecu will reset itself
Title: Re: Broken Negative Battery Terminal
Post by: Antoni0_23 on July 04, 2009, 02:02:03 PM
Thanks I upgraded the terminals to the streetwire brand that you posted and now the car starts fine. The needle is all messed up. I haven't let it idle. Should I let it idle for some time to see if the RPM needle comes back down? I mean it's really off. It's all the way after the 8k mark and it's now gone behind the speedo. I'm gonna let it idle for a while to see if the needle comes back down. If not what can I do to get it to work normally again? Thanks!
Title: Re: Broken Negative Battery Terminal
Post by: Knocturnal84 on July 04, 2009, 03:44:32 PM
thats funny i did the same thing on the highway and my car was still running.. i only found out after i shut the car off at the gas station and could not restart.... nothing happened to the needle though
Title: Re: Broken Negative Battery Terminal
Post by: wtcii on July 04, 2009, 03:51:55 PM
How long have you let the car sit completely off the battery
Title: Re: Broken Negative Battery Terminal
Post by: Antoni0_23 on July 05, 2009, 06:08:41 PM
Well the battery was off for about 10 hours. But it's working fine now.I drove it around and the RPM needle fell to it's normal position and it's working flawlessly now. Thanks guys!
Title: Re: Broken Negative Battery Terminal
Post by: Paulius005 on July 07, 2009, 12:46:33 AM
Yeah that happened to me, those terminals dont last very long if you fiddle with your car's electronics and disconnect the battery a lot.
Title: Re: Broken Negative Battery Terminal
Post by: timot_one on July 07, 2009, 08:07:32 AM
I've got an extra OEM battery ground strap. It's yours if you want it. Just pay for shipping.
Title: Re: Broken Negative Battery Terminal
Post by: thisaznboi88 on July 24, 2009, 09:41:53 PM
wtf your need is at 8k? Spoon sport accord?
Title: Re: Broken Negative Battery Terminal
Post by: CrackerTeg on July 24, 2009, 09:58:38 PM
Holy late response Ken!
Title: Re: Broken Negative Battery Terminal
Post by: timot_one on July 25, 2009, 10:41:28 AM
No shit man. I've been in a K24 Accord that revs up to 8k though.
Title: Re: Broken Negative Battery Terminal
Post by: Antoni0_23 on July 25, 2009, 09:42:56 PM
lol. Yeah Pretty late. It was very scary seeing the needle that high. Anyhow thanks for the offer tim but shipping would be outrageous even for that small part. If it does break again or my negative cable breaks in half I'll definitely contact you. Thanks again though.
Title: Re: Broken Negative Battery Terminal
Post by: cna on July 25, 2009, 09:52:18 PM
yea stock terminals suck my positive side never seems to want to tighten all the way and the negative is just crap i will be upgrading the terminals and making my own negative cables
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: AV6NHBP6SPD on January 03, 2010, 09:10:36 PM
well my battery died today so i guess ill be looking for new battery. will try to keep under 100 since i dont have audio system or anything
probably gona get duralast gold its 620CCA
there is regular duralast which is 500CCA.
what you think. is there much difference? i think honda battery that i had is 400CCA
probably gona get duralast gold its 620CCA
there is regular duralast which is 500CCA.
what you think. is there much difference? i think honda battery that i had is 400CCA
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: timot_one on January 03, 2010, 11:42:15 PM
That extra just might help you start your car on a cold ass day.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: Mike on January 04, 2010, 08:19:57 AM
I'd stay away from duralast I personally have had nothing but, problems with them. I'd go with Diehard or Interstae the prices should be close to the same, and I think you will have better results.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: slipkord on January 04, 2010, 08:31:05 AM
Quote from: "lavalleemike"
I'd stay away from duralast I personally have had nothing but, problems with them. I'd go with Diehard or Interstae the prices should be close to the same, and I think you will have better results.
+1
I'm still running the same battery since it was new in the Honda. I'm sure it'll give up through this winter though. I've actually had good luck with Walmart batteries, believe it or not.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: wtcii on January 04, 2010, 09:45:53 AM
I have had a Duralast Gold in my car since May of 07, when I got it. I havent had any problems out of it at all, but I also live in a some what mild climate with lows around 20. I also keep my car in a climate controlled garage 99% of the time, so that might help.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: Jeff Likes Bagels on January 04, 2010, 09:51:39 AM
I got the Duralast red top for the i4 recently, and it works fine under normal conditions, but I noticed that when it gets really cold it immediately gets really weak to start. But that's to be known with cold weather. Whenever this one dies I'm going to upgrade to the v6 battery and possibly get the Duralast gold top, or something of equivalence.
Title: Re: What battery to get
Post by: Mike on January 04, 2010, 10:05:33 AM
My car also still has the factory original battery. I would stay away from auto zone parts as much as possiable. A lot of the brands they carry have gone to shit IMO.
Title: Bad Battery or Alternator Problem?
Post by: rich on March 13, 2011, 11:30:32 PM
so with my new job being that i travel a lot, i originally had my girl starting my car once or twice a week while i was gone. after the 3rd week i was gone she went to start it and it was dead 100%, didnt even click or anything she said. so i started to disconnect the battery when i left in case i had a power drain somewhere. when i reconnected it, it still needed a jump start. i was out of town for a week this past week and i had to jump it again. now since i've been driving it everyday, whenever i go to start it, it seems to lag when starting. the battery is a yellow top optima that is about 3 years old and i thought these batteries are supposed to last longer than that?? sometimes it wont even remote start because that's using more juice to remote start it.
i honestly dont have the patience or time to troubleshoot a battery drain and im hoping its just a bad battery that i can easily replace.
or is there something else i'm missing and could try without getting all up in the engine and shit?
i honestly dont have the patience or time to troubleshoot a battery drain and im hoping its just a bad battery that i can easily replace.
or is there something else i'm missing and could try without getting all up in the engine and shit?
Title: Re: Bad Battery or Alternator Problem?
Post by: k24low20z on March 13, 2011, 11:39:58 PM
i had a yellow optima take a shit on me last year.. i got a duramaxx at walmart and called it a day.
Title: Re: Bad Battery or Alternator Problem?
Post by: rich on March 13, 2011, 11:56:46 PM
yeah well if i didnt have my damn tsunami battery top distribution block i would just get a battery that is really good but cheaper than the optima
(http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m313/96gtivr6/IMG_8705.jpg)
(http://i107.photobucket.com/albums/m313/96gtivr6/IMG_8705.jpg)
Title: Re: Bad Battery or Alternator Problem?
Post by: rich on March 14, 2011, 06:10:56 PM
got a new one and have no issues now. was a battery problem
Title: Re: Bad Battery or Alternator Problem?
Post by: timot_one on March 14, 2011, 11:24:52 PM
Optima batteries are no longer good. They got bought out by another company, cut costs, and aren't worth shit any more.
Title: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: Lu Mcfly on July 28, 2011, 03:31:17 AM
So a few days ago I notice that the start up on the car was sluggish as if the battery was going dead. This continued for a day or two everytime I would leave the car off for a hour or even less. but some how the car always managed to turn on And run fine so I assumed there was a electrical consumption going on when the car was off. I have a capaciter hooked up with my amps and it shows a digital reading of the battery voltage and I can see the voltage dropping as the car was off until the capaciter eventually shuts off so I knew it wasnt that. I took it to the shop and I told them I thought it was either the viper alarm, foglight relay, or something else draining the battery, and they said the battery is no good. Any advice before I buy a new battery. Any battery in particular? Was going to get the yellow top optima but its jus too much money. i also cleaned the corrosion from the positive terminal and still had the problem.
Thanks
Thanks
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: Mike on July 28, 2011, 06:51:38 AM
Optima isn't as good as it used to be. Avoid duralast and you should be okay. I've had good luck with Autocraft Gold, and Die Hard.
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: Rushzer0 on July 28, 2011, 07:38:23 AM
I used to have a duralast till it up and died :p now I have an excide gel cell (sorta like the optimas)
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: Lu Mcfly on July 28, 2011, 03:02:44 PM
Thanks for the replies...will these batteries be good for all the stuff im running on my car...2 amps w/ 2 12" subs, 4 interior speakers
Title: Re: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: CrackerTeg on July 28, 2011, 03:17:09 PM
Yes. A battery is a battery. Except for those tiny race batteries that can't support that many accessories.
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: Lu Mcfly on July 28, 2011, 03:39:39 PM
o ok...thanks guys
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: thisaznboi88 on July 28, 2011, 06:54:51 PM
I got a walmart battery. Its way stronger then OEM. Almost double the CCA and reserved. Plus if it ever fail there always a walmart around.
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: Lu Mcfly on July 28, 2011, 10:01:44 PM
No walmarts near me..only in nj
Title: Re: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: CrackerTeg on July 28, 2011, 10:13:59 PM
Then go to pep boys or something. Just don't go to autozone.
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: timot_one on July 29, 2011, 09:15:34 AM
Wait a minute here? Your capacitor has a volt meter on it? Have you tested the voltage at your battery? It sounds like your capacitor is discharging. You may want to try disconnecting the capacitor and your system. That could be where your current draw is coming from. There is absolutely no reason why your fog light relay would be the source of your current draw if your fog lights are off. A standard SPST or SPDT relay only draws 150 mA (which is very little) when the coil is energized. The security system you have would have close to the same current draw, if it was installed properly.
I'd disconnect the power for your system from the battery and monitor what happens.
I'd disconnect the power for your system from the battery and monitor what happens.
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: gargantula99 on July 29, 2011, 05:16:46 PM
What's wrong with duralast batteries.
Title: Re: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: CrackerTeg on July 29, 2011, 06:22:57 PM
They're not built to last.
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: gargantula99 on July 29, 2011, 07:39:10 PM
But it's got a warranty.
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: timot_one on July 29, 2011, 07:45:27 PM
:mad6:
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: cna on July 29, 2011, 08:11:37 PM
it has a 8yr warranty for a reason you going to end up swaping it out at lest once a year trust me i know i have the gold top one ::)
Title: Re: Re: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: CrackerTeg on July 29, 2011, 08:38:08 PM
it has a 8yr warranty for a reason you going to end up swaping it out at lest once a year trust me i know i have the gold top one ::)
Game. Set. Match.Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: Mike on July 29, 2011, 08:56:19 PM
They are trash and alot of that warranty is only "prorated"
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: Lu Mcfly on July 29, 2011, 11:58:39 PM
I'll try that when I get a chance, just dont have a voltmeter handy. But I never had a problem with my system before so its wierd that all of a sudden its doing this. The reason I thought it might of been the foglight relay is because one burned out on me so I had to replace it and thats when the problems started.
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: Mike on July 30, 2011, 07:14:03 AM
Audio components can go bad. A bad cap could discharge your battery pretty fast.
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: Lu Mcfly on July 30, 2011, 02:32:32 PM
The capacitor i have turns off when the car is off and i dont think its that.
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: timot_one on July 30, 2011, 03:05:37 PM
Capacitors don't just "turn off". Capacitors store energy for quick discharge and recovery. You can go ahead and do what you want though. Replace your battery if you feel it's necessary.
FYI, there's already a thread about batteries. You should have posted in there instead of creating a new thread. Then again, you posted about an electrical problem in the Stock Motors, Transmission, & Maintenance forum instead of the appropriate Alarms, Wiring, Harnesses, & Other Electrical Upgrades forum. I'm guessing you probably didn't bother to research first.
FYI, there's already a thread about batteries. You should have posted in there instead of creating a new thread. Then again, you posted about an electrical problem in the Stock Motors, Transmission, & Maintenance forum instead of the appropriate Alarms, Wiring, Harnesses, & Other Electrical Upgrades forum. I'm guessing you probably didn't bother to research first.
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: thisaznboi88 on July 31, 2011, 12:55:42 AM
how about costco? They might carry the redtop? I ono
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: cna on July 31, 2011, 03:08:42 AM
how about costco? They might carry the redtop? I ono
Here in Ny costco has redtops
Title: Re: Bad battery I think...need opinion before buying new battery
Post by: timot_one on July 31, 2011, 10:17:26 PM
You may have missed this post. If you really want to waste the money on the Optima name with half the quality, go for it.
This is a topic has already been discussed and this thread should have never been created. I'm lumping this into the existing battery thread.
Optima isn't as good as it used to be.
This is a topic has already been discussed and this thread should have never been created. I'm lumping this into the existing battery thread.
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Lu Mcfly on August 01, 2011, 05:20:29 PM
Only reason i did that was because i saw a few battery threads in that same forum section. But i think ill hold off on the battery til i can definitely determine what it is...Thanks
Title: Re: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: CrackerTeg on August 01, 2011, 06:40:49 PM
No worries. They shouldn't have been in there to begin with so it got cleaned up. Don't sweat it dude.
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Moessteezy on January 28, 2012, 01:10:31 AM
hey umm the last couple of days ive been having trouble with starting my car. Battery keeps going dead everytime i park it for a couple of hours. I know the alternator is fine cuz it has never died on me while i was driving. I took it to autozone and they said the battery is 100%
I did just get an audio system put in a month ago.
help me ???
I did just get an audio system put in a month ago.
help me ???
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: timot_one on January 28, 2012, 01:22:53 AM
Did they test the alternator?
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Moessteezy on January 28, 2012, 01:53:35 AM
no they didnt. but can't you test it by just taking off the positive connector while the car is running.?
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: gargantula99 on January 28, 2012, 04:19:58 AM
Dejavu all over again. When will people learn?
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Moessteezy on January 28, 2012, 04:50:20 AM
You dont know what you dont know.
::)
::)
Title: Re: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: gargantula99 on January 28, 2012, 08:39:31 AM
No. That's an old school trick, and doesn't apply to our cars. The best way to test your alternator is to get a digital multi meter and see if you're getting over 12.6 volts while your car is running, with all your electronic accessories turned off (stereo, headlights, hvac). Your battery should be 12.6 volts when not running, and above 12.6 volts when your car is running to show that your alternator is charging your battery.
Do a search for alternator.
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Moessteezy on January 28, 2012, 08:41:39 PM
I found out what my problem was my I wasnt getting a proper connection to my battery. so i cleaned off the battery terminals with some water and baking soda. and sanded down the terminals. Havnt given me any problems since.
ok thanks for the info, well definitely use this if i have altenator problems in the future.
ok thanks for the info, well definitely use this if i have altenator problems in the future.
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: timot_one on January 28, 2012, 08:50:06 PM
For the record, you should be getting around 14 volts with your car running. Paul had cleared that up in that thread. I'm not really sure why people keep pulling the negative or positive battery terminals from their battery to test their alternators. If you have half a brain and a multimeter you can test your alternator a lot faster.
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Moessteezy on January 28, 2012, 09:23:42 PM
For the record, you should be getting around 14 volts with your car running. Paul had cleared that up in that thread. I'm not really sure why people keep pulling the negative or positive battery terminals from their battery to test their alternators. If you have half a brain and a multimeter you can test your alternator a lot faster.
haha well i guess ill know for next time. thanks for the info.
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: booley on March 16, 2013, 09:16:17 AM
Well, the Optima's are still around... Are they really as crappy as you guys say?
Also, does anybody have any feedback on the Odyssey pc925? I know the 680 would be too small, but the 925 might work, yes or no??
Also, does anybody have any feedback on the Odyssey pc925? I know the 680 would be too small, but the 925 might work, yes or no??
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: alpha on March 16, 2013, 10:40:51 AM
Well, the Optima's are still around... Are they really as crappy as you guys say?
Ever since the production plant moved from Aurora, CO to Mexico, yes. The design changed when the production plant was moved; I believe it went from a 6-cell design to a 3-cell design.Title: Re: Re: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Mike on March 16, 2013, 01:54:00 PM
Well, the Optima's are still around... Are they really as crappy as you guys say?
Also, does anybody have any feedback on the Odyssey pc925? I know the 680 would be too small, but the 925 might work, yes or no??
Working part time in a parts store we get more optimas back than we do our store brand. We sell 10 store brand to 1 optima. The quality is really badAlso, does anybody have any feedback on the Odyssey pc925? I know the 680 would be too small, but the 925 might work, yes or no??
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: timot_one on March 16, 2013, 02:14:25 PM
Mark and Mike are correct. While they are still around a a brand, Optima has cut corners with design and manufacturing. Only 3 of the cells are spiral cells now.
I would choose the Odyssey battery instead.
I would choose the Odyssey battery instead.
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Pascal on November 18, 2014, 10:52:00 PM
Appart from odyssey (expensive as hell but about the best) and optima (that now seems to be not that good for the price), what are other options in the middle class of batteries, something with a good amount of CCA (Canada winter) and still affortable. I've heard some good reviews on kirkland batteries but it's "only" 640 CCA for a group 35, I actualy have a 450 CCA group 51R carquest battery with some years on it, but it always was hard to crank on cold days. Would a "standard type" group 35 battery for around 100-150$ make a good difference over my actual 51R or paying almost 300$ for a optima really makes that much of a difference so it justifies the extra bucks ?
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: timot_one on November 19, 2014, 01:06:09 AM
Give the kirkland brand stuff a try if you want. I was able to fit a 34/78 in my battery tray, so you can go bigger if you want to. I went in the other direction this time though. I wanted to save room and relocated my battery to the sub frame in front of the transmission, so I went with a small Braille battery.
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Pascal on November 19, 2014, 07:25:10 AM
The kirkland group 34 is rated at 795 CCA, not bad ! it you say it fitted in the tray that could be a good choice. The average cost of them is 80$ and they have a awsome waranty. For the price, I don't have anything to lose !
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: ikethegreat on November 19, 2014, 07:29:59 AM
I love my Optima yellow top. I sit in my car everyday for my hour long lunch break and listen to the radio or ipod without the car running. It always starts right up afterwards. You can find them for under $200 if you look hard enough.
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Pascal on November 19, 2014, 07:36:51 AM
Having a optima, it would be a red top for their CCA rating
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: timot_one on November 19, 2014, 09:29:08 AM
I had a red top back in the day, it was a good battery and lasted for years. It's in my mom's Cadillac now. This was before they were shit though.
I can't remember if the 34/78 I had fit in the tray or not. I think I removed all the plastic crap and just had a rubber mat under the battery on the tray and the upper battery holder piece.
I can't remember if the 34/78 I had fit in the tray or not. I think I removed all the plastic crap and just had a rubber mat under the battery on the tray and the upper battery holder piece.
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Pascal on November 19, 2014, 10:09:40 AM
okay, i'll use my stock tray for now and hunt the junk yard until I find a v6 one to make it look more like stock. 795 CCA should be more than enough to start the call well anyway, nothing justifies the expense of a "better" brand for the CCA difference.
Thanks for the info !
Thanks for the info !
Title: Re:
Post by: Mike on November 19, 2014, 08:02:59 PM
I would personally chase the longest warranty. Having worked in the parts industry the quality of all brands can be suspect. I've seen brand new batteries of every brand shit the bed after 6 months. Also if you go with an Optima never buy it from a parts store. They sit on the shelves for years!
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Pascal on November 19, 2014, 10:52:42 PM
Kirkland has a really good waranty. That is a good point about buying a optima battery, you don't want to buy a new used battery !
Title: Re:
Post by: Mike on November 21, 2014, 09:37:40 PM
Not used just old lol. Parts stores sometimes have used batteries also. Those are real cheap but carry no warranty. Advance is 40 I think
Title: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Pascal on November 21, 2014, 10:43:21 PM
yeah that's what I meant buy "used", sorry about that, my english isn't perfect :P
Title: Re: Re: The Only Battery Thread You Should Ever Post In
Post by: Mike on November 23, 2014, 03:26:12 PM
All good...