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I started to notice this a few months ago but wasn't too sure what it was.

I noticed that my rpms while cruising were not the same as a few months prior. I have a 4cyl auto with 90k miles. Before this happened at 60mph I would have been at 2krpm and at 75mph I would be at 2500rpm.

Now at 60mph im at 2200ish and when im at 75mph Im at 2800rpm.

I tried counting how many times the car shift but I couldn't come with a concise number.

I did notice after a 30min drive and after checking the fluid it is 1/4inch overfilled. Can this be the problem? The D light is not blinking and I can't tell if my CEL is on because I have kpro.

You should still be able to read a code on your ECU.  Just ignore all the codes about sensors malfunctioning and what not since they are connected to KPro.  The fact that your tranny fluid is overfilled might be part of it too.  Have you drained the excess fluid yet?

I've heard of auto trannies not shifting properly because of over filling. I'm not sure if it causes loss of pressure because of high volume or the reverse effect. Then again, the auto trannies these days shift so smooth you'll hardly notice the 1-2 shift and think you missed a gear. Maybe someone else with better experience on Honda auto trannies can chime in. I've only had MT Hondas.

My 1st to 2nd and 2nd to 3rd make my head rock back and forth. Nowhere near smooth lol. I have to do a drain and refill 3x after the winter is over.

Like I said:

Yea, I wish I had a MT. I'd say take out excess fluid (remember car should be warmed up when you check). Then take it for another spin.

I've read that over filling the transmission can cause the fluid to foam up, and cause problems. It's possible that if the fluid is over full the it's causing your issue take out the excess, and hope you don't have a tranny issue!

The K24 AT's haven't been known to have problems like the V6, have they?  I'm not really up on the AT's.

I hope thats the problem imma try to take out the excess tomorrow. For the time being anyone have any other ideas?

I'd say removing the extra would be a pretty good first step.  You may end up racking your brain about the other "what ifs" when it could be as simple as too much fluid.  When was the last time you changed your transmission fluid?

I'm with Tim on this. Definitely the most logical first step.

I did the change about 2 months or so ago. I took off the drain bolt and let it all run out. Waited about 30min then poured 3 bottles of honda atf-z1.

Your transmission could very well be over full, Just simply pulling the plug out of the transmission isn't likly to drain all of the fluid. There are alot of places inside the valve body that would still hold fluid even with the plug out.  That is why the suggested procedure is to drian, fill, drive and then repeat a couple of times to get as much of the old fluid out as possiable.

A little overfull (as you described) would not cause a problem, now with the stock ECU throwing codes and not getting all data because of KPro, now that can cause a issue, tranny shifting in these cars is very dependant on feedback from the TPS and MAP sensors, it sets up the "grade logic" that honda has in there for shifting, if the TPS is disconnected your stock ECU could be reading as you are always at or near WOT and therefor does not shift into 5th and thinks you are climbing a steep hill or trying to accelerate to pass and keeps it in 4th. How are you other gears shifting? At what RPMs?

Also if the fluid was foaming due to being sloshed around by spiining tranny componets it would be easily seen by pulling out the dipstick while the car was ideling, the stick would have foamy (lots of air bubles) fluid on it.

You said that your car was shifting into 5th before with KPro, right?  Can you pull all the codes you're getting from your stock ECU?

If you have ruled out your kpro and transmission fluid level, you should also see if you noticed a big change in fuel economy and if you can check the transmission fluid temperature sensor and see if it's higher than normal.  If that's so, it might be that your torque converter malfunctioning.  It could be that your stator is seized. The other issue could be that your isn't applying the torque converter clutch. Like NVA-AV6 said, our cars rely heavily on sensor inputs. If just one input wasn't being sent to the ecu, it will not enable something to function. (i.e. your torque converter clutch).

I havent taken out the excess fluid yet and ill check to see if all the sensors are hooked up, but it was fine a few months before.

yeah there has been a decrease in mileage. 1-2 mpg decrease recently.

shifting a  little jerky at cold temps. Not too bad, maybe its just been really cold lately.

But at freeway speed it shifts fine. goes to about 3000rpm and drops to 1700-2000 when it shifts. No flare ups so i dont think its slipping.

yesterday however I think i saw it shift to 5th gear. I just reached 65 after accelerating probably 1/2 throttle and started to cruise. RPM dropped to 2200ish and stayed there. I gave it a little gas probably 5% from cruise position. It downshifted or looked like it did, jumped to about 3500rpm. Didn't look like a slipping tranny because i started to pick up speed. From that point on it was about 500rpm higher at all highway speed compared to stock.

My transmission is very smooth. I do know that it shifts 5 times. I dont know if it is bad for the car but you could try manually shifting through the gears that count from the last shift. The last one is barely noticeable in my car, it may not even be a gear. I get confused with gears and overdrives and stuff, so who knows. I know our cars have 5 gears then a final drive gear, hence, five shifts.

I think you're mistaken Bill. The 5th gear is the over drive gear. You'll only feel 4 shifts.

What is the final drive then? I know I see five changes in the RPMs.

you should only see 4 shifts. your car is already in first > second > third > fourth > fifth. The final drive is not an actual driving gear. I can't explain what it is however.

I need to pull the codes from the stock ecu. I need to pin up the k line for it.

The final drive is like a gear multiplier. If you're familiar with Ford and Chevy rear ends, the final drive is very similar to the gearing in the rear differential of those vehicles, hence why you hear of guys swapping for 4:10's, 3:73's, etc. for drag setups. Consider the final drive as the differential from those RWD vehicles pushed up into the transmission to create FWD. That's the best explanation I could come up with.

http://image.automotive.com/f/tech/8509 ... n_gear.jpg (http://image.automotive.com/f/tech/8509495+pheader/turp_0804_01_z+kia_sportage_s2000+ring_and_pinion_gear.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

A picture of a final drive from an s2k if that helps

Thank you Mike!

Interesting note I did what one of you suggested and kept it in D3 then shift it to D. That gets it to shift into 5th. I know its 5th because it shifted twice after and my revs returned to normal. 75 @ 2500RPM.

Didn't have time to pull the code because autozone apparently doesn't do this anymore. You have to buy it. Anyone know where I can get access to one other than buying one?

advance auto will still do this. they have always had better customer service.

My Honda dealership does it for free. You may want to try that.

They lied to you.  Auto Zone still does that around here, and I'm sure it's a company wide thing.  Call around to different Auto Zones in your area.  My guess is that the guy you talked to was just a fat lazy pile of shit that didn't want to do his fucking job.

lol I know the kragen here in merced won't do it, but I know 1 of the guy so he does it when his boss is not around.

+1. I've gotten this done a couple times in the last month for two different cars at two different locations.

Well, I finally took off my Kpro. My transmission shifts fine now. It must be a loose connection or something with the harness.

Are you going to fix the harness or send it to Cham to fix?

I think I'm going to fix it myself. I need some extra pins though. Do you know where to get some?

I honestly don't.  I'd ask Cham if he has any that he can send you.

Ive hooked up all the sensors that need to be hooked up now. It shifts to 5th now but only when im gingerly pressing on the pedal. If I floor it, it gets stuck in 4th or if im rolling down the mountain without giving it gas. It gets stuck for like 5 min or so then shifts to 5th. Its like its waiting to make sure I don't need floor it again. Any thoughts?

Hmmmm.  That's odd.  What sensors weren't hooked up?  I wish there was something I could do to help you out, but I just don't know enough about the harness and AT's to give you advice.

Sounds like you missed hooking up one of the clutch pressure switches or have them reversed. Check parts 9 & 19 in the link below, they are AT clutch pressure switches and are used to determine gear engagment.....

http://www.bkhondaparts.com/billkay/jsp ... LENOID+(L4 (http://www.bkhondaparts.com/billkay/jsp/prddisplay.jsp?inputstate=5&catcgry1=ACCORD&catcgry2=2006&catcgry3=2DR+EX&catcgry4=KA5AT&catcgry5=AT+SOLENOID+(L4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;))&ListAll=All&vinsrch=no&systemcomp=List All

Ill have to check that out on the harness. Do you happen to know where they are paul? A,B,C,D,E connector?

Well, when I let the stock computer control idle it was kinda sketchy sometimes. Like if i lift off the throttle the rpm would drop to 1.5k and bounce once or twice to stabilize. I took pauls advice and consulted the troubleshooting manual and hooked up the MAP sensor. That stabilized the rpm when I lift the throttle now.

I've also hooked up the signal grounds 1,2 and the voltage connection 1,2. I didn't notice anything different but the temp guage is even slower to read. Could this be the problem? On the electrical diagrams I've noticed the transmission needs input on engine coolant temps. Could the guage reading slowly confuse the transmission computer? Is there a way to hook up an alternate engine coolant temp guage so I don't have to split up the signal? The hotter the car, longer the trip, the more chance of me going into 5th. Could i just have a shotty electrical connection that messes up once in a while?

When I go uphill and am in 4th gear, 10seconds or so into the climb if I don't alter any throttle input it shifts to 5th. If im lucky and don't lift the throttle too much during my trip it stays in 5th. But sometimes it will downshift to 4th no matter how gingerly I touch the throttle.

This is annoying because in 4th without the converter lockup the car is really slow even with kpro.

Well, look at what controls the ECUs decision to downshift, pressure switches/TPS if I remember right.... Also all AT specific connections are on C.

I have the stock connectors hooked up for  C and D because those are what contol the auto tranny.

Ive hooked up about 5 sensors/grounds that might have been important on connector A.

is this multimeter a good one to use on the car? Can this be used on the car? http://www.licensedelectrician.com/Stor ... P-A_lg.jpg (http://www.licensedelectrician.com/Store/AM/Images/5XP-A_lg.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

Most certianly, LOL, I still use my old fluke, a meter is a meter....

Thanks, was just making sure everthing looks so complicated.

AND, I think the transmission sorta sorted itself out. Question is, is it possible for the stock computer to hold it in 4th until its sure im on level road? Is this normal operation of the grade logic in the PCM? I can't/don't remember if it did this stock.

Sounds like it is holding for a bit long.

I dont know if i have a code but sounds like my car.

DTC - P0715 (INPUT SHAFT SPEED SENSOR SYSTEM)
Code No. P0715 input shaft speed sensor system
If no output pulse is detected from the input shaft speed sensor for 1 second or more while driving in 3rd or 4th gear at a speed of 30 km/h (19 mph) or more, it is judged to be an open circuit or short-circuit in the input shaft speed sensor and diagnostic trouble code No. P0715 is output. If diagnostic trouble code P0715 is output four times, the transaxle is locked into 3rd gear or 2nd gear as a fail-safe measure.
Probable cause
Malfunction of the input shaft speed sensor
Malfunction of the underdrive clutch retainer
Malfunction of connector
Malfunction of the TCM

Hmmmm.... Some owners of 4cyl on V6P are experiencing the same thing and they are stock. Maybe its the ATF strainer?

Hmmm.  That's not a good sign.